LJC Community Conversation: Categorizing Latin Jazz
LJC Community Conversations are designed to explore major ideas in the Latin Jazz world together as a community and inspire conversation through comments. My main motivator here is my belief that LJC readers hold a great deal of knowledge and passion around Latin Jazz, and I think that we can learn something from everyone. Whether you’re a seasoned Latin Jazz performer or a newcomer to the music, leave a comment and let your voice be heard!
This week’s Community Conversation originally had a different focus, but yesterday’s comment from Reginald about Jazz.com’s article “The Dozens: Latin Jazz Classics” got me thinking . . .
The term “Latin Jazz” creates many problems for me; I’ve never felt that it fairly represents the music. The term promotes generalizations that always confused my understanding of the music. Why can someone hear a Brazilian Samba and a Cuban Rumba and refer to both as a Latin rhythm? Aren’t they different musical styles that demand diverse approaches? “Latin Jazz” doesn’t truly describe what most artists try to create - a connection to both jazz and a cultural tradition from either South America or the Caribbean. Last time I checked, “Latin” isn’t a country or race. The generic catchall phrase “Latin Jazz” also downplays the music’s seriousness. It implies that the music’s roots in Cuba, Brazil, Peru, or elsewhere just don’t matter. It seems like another term would better suit the music.
In reality, the term “Latin Jazz” probably won’t disappear anytime soon. Ultra specific terminology tends to alienate new listeners, putting them in the position of “outsiders.” General terms like “Latin” provoke something in the public eye - most of the thoughts revolve around stereotypes, but those stereotypes help sell music. The music industry has sold millions of records based upon “Latin” stereotypes; Carmen Miranda, Desi Arnez, Perez Prado, and more deeply ingrained this mentality, at least in the United States, and resultantly they moved product. These days, we have iTunes Latino and the Latin Grammy Awards sitting among countless institutions based upon the generic “Latin” identity. The “Latin” idea is just too familiar, so Latin Jazz will most likely stay attached.
We can recognize that musicians imply many different approaches to Latin Jazz, and then categorize the music based on those differences. When considering different categories of Latin Jazz, there are several views to consider . . .
Categorize by Country: Latin Jazz could easily be broken into Cuban Jazz, Brazilian Jazz, Peruvian Jazz, Argentinean Jazz, Puerto Rican Jazz, and more. This connects the music more authentically to its cultural roots, most likely painting a truer picture of the artist’s intent. This still raises some questions for me . . . If I have a recording of Chucho Valdes playing a swing tune, is this Cuban Jazz? In other words, are we talking about the rhythms or the musician?
Categorize by Style: Titles could refer to the song’s specific style - Bomba Jazz, Salsa Jazz, Tango Jazz, Samba Jazz, etc . . . This approach cues more closely into the genre, but it lacks a connection to the music’s cultural background. It also may confuse listeners that don’t understand the musical differences between styles.
Categorize by Musical Trends: Traditional Jazz history takes this approach, but I’m not sure whether it would be appropriate for Latin Jazz. We could isolate Mambo Big Bands, Latin Jazz Big Bands, Small Group Latin Jazz, Smooth Latin Jazz, Avant-Garde Latin Jazz, and more. These categories seem too broad for me though, and again, they don’t necessarily reflect the musicians’ priorities.
Categorize by Region: Artists create different music based upon their surroundings - should we isolate East Coast Latin Jazz, West Coast Latin Jazz, European Latin Jazz, South American Latin Jazz, and more? This again builds large categories, but shows differences between musicians.
This is an overwhelming topic that has bothered me for years; I could really use your input. Let’s get the discussion going - LEAVE A COMMENT and make your voice heard. I’ve isolated a few major questions:
*Do you think that we need a term other than Latin Jazz?
*How would you best categorize the sub-sets of Latin Jazz?
*Do you think that smaller categories would help clarify people’s understanding of the music or just confuse the issue?
Leave a conversation below with your thoughts - we’d love a wide range of voices on this subject. Do we need smaller categories for Latin Jazz? Am I making a big deal out of nothing? Whatever your opinion, share it! Your comment will be appreciated!
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Chazro - e-mail me with your address so that I can send those CDs out to you!
On another note - Reginald’s comment about new releases also brought a thought to mind - would a weekly new feature with album releases, performance dates, etc . . . be useful? It may take a while to build, but once I get the word out to artists, labels, and promo people, I’m sure that I could provide weekly info. Let me know if you’d like to see this.
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Wazzup Chip! I touched on this subject briefly on a prior post, about the ‘Latin Jazz’ musical universe being as diverse as the ‘Standard’ Jazz universe. I can’t add too much to your analysis of the situation. I agree and share your frustration. My opinion is that while one could certainly divide the Latin Jazz genre into a multitude of sub-genre’s it’ll never happen. The potential for mis-categorization would be huge, not to mention that most Latin Jazz Can be CROSS-categorized. Just think, Big Band Cuban vs. Big Band NY. The Choro Ensemble plays wonderful Brazilian music but they’re from NY! How many different categories would Bobby Sanabria’s latest record fall into? The only advantage would be at awards time where a single ‘Latin Jazz’ award hardly seems fair to the diversity contained within the genre. It might help the veteran Latin Jazz fan as far as identifying a certain recording/artist but I think it would only confuse a novice. Our problem (if we want to call it that!:) is the abundance of riches within the Latin Jazz universe!
As far as implementing a ‘Latest Releases’ section to the Corner, I give that idea 2 very enthusiastic thumbs up!!!
(BTW - I PM’d you my address a 2nd time, plz advise if you haven’t rec’d it yet, thx!)
One day a gentleman named Jazz, from up north, met a hot latin Rumba and they fell in love and they got kids… Some other time that same guy met a beautiful brazilian samba and, guess what happened… I could go on and on and on … all over the world…
I am not much of a poet but I hope you get my point.
I think we started something too big for us. We will never win. Like you said the term Latin Jazz will never disappear. It is a matter of culture. To most people , anything with a conga is latin (in fact it’s african but let’s not start something else). We just have to live with it. This is life. We will keep being disappointed when Michel Camilo wins a latin jazz grammy when to you, your idea of latin jazz is eddie palmieri. Latin Jazz lovers will keep being frustrated depending on which side of the “center” they are.
Guys like me, I have to feel the rhythm, I have to feel the clave, I love the bebop riffs, I appreciate the complex harmonizations, the well thought-out arrangements, but the percussion section have to be solid, and the bass is fine with the basic 1-3-5-3-1.
Which can lead us to the next topic. Jazz being the music of free expression par excellence, should not we be thinking of the descargas of yesterday as the real Latin Jazz. Not some hybrid mixture of american music and latin music.
I hope I did not go too far this time.
I think I have been more volubile than Chazro this time. What do you want… I am passionate.
Excellent idea on those latest releases. I trust your judgement and knowledge of latin jazz. By the way, I did put the Alfredo Naranjo and the Changuito on my list.
Thanks.
Chazro - I agree with you whole-heartedly on this one, mis-categorization certainly would be the result of categorizing Latin Jazz. The cross referencing that Latin Jazz musicians do brings them into contact with a variety of styles and influences. You’ve made some great examples there, and putting an exact term on music would be confusing to most people. Honestly, creating more confusion is the LAST thing I want to do!
I guess that I just want to find a common approach to refer to different Latin Jazz approaches, here at LJC and in other things that I do. I think that I’ll be using the overall term Latin Jazz for broad topics and refering to different approaches by country. In doing this, I’ll be refering to the country of origin of the rhythmic genre. Hopefully this won’t confuse issues too much - I’m dreading the next review that I write that includes a variety of rhythmic styles. I’ll really have to think about the wording on that one! While this terminology may not go into wide usage, I think that it will help me be a bit more specific here at LJC.
Inspired by the enthusiasm from you guys, I’m working on a news/latest release section; should be up in the next couple of weeks.
I haven’t gotten your PMs, e-mail would probably be best!
Just sent a 3rd e-mail to chip@chipboaz.com, hope it happens this time!
I had a thought about the categorization thing. For me, especially when you review Latin Jazz from other countries, it would be a HUGE help and motivater if it would be possible to compare the music/band to a (for lack of a better word)established artist/music. For instance, “if you dig Irakere, this band is for you”, or at the end of the review, list 2-3 recordings that might establish a frame of reference for the potential buyer (me!). Just a thought.